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Talk:Law & Order - Season 10
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The more I look at this, the more I think this is gun is more than just a dressed up Skorpion. While it does have the slots on both sides for the bolt actuator, the slots are a lot wider than those seen on a Skorpion. The sights are different, but I suppose those wouldn't have been too hard to change, but the ridges on the receiver are gone as well. Did they just mate two different guns together? If so, what's the other gun? --Funkychinaman (talk) 11:08, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- I agree it's a Scorpion. I can't swear to this but I think the bottom gun is a specially-modified prop - I remember in that scene McCoy hands it to Trope and during his testimony he disassembles it to demonstrate how he (easily) converted it to full-auto with the ordered parts and instructions he received. I don't recall if any of the pieces he strips out and shows are authentic so it could be a made-up prop just for that scene, with some outer pieces changed to allow it to be easily and quickly taken apart by the actor. I could be wrong but it's a thought. I have to say you're doing an excellent job on these pages, I really like how well you've formatted the pages and also added fairly in-depth descriptions of the show and characters/actors for each season. Nice work thus far. StanTheMan (talk) 11:32, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- The shape and the pistol grip scream Skorpion, but everything else seems a bit off. McCoy does hand it to Trope (who had already plead guilty and was actually a witness for the prosecution) and Trope does disassemble it and show how he converted it to full auto. Apparently, it only involved filing down part of the bolt (which many characters commented on during the episode), swapping out one of the springs, and soldering (welding?) in a new guide plate. I highly doubt it is any way realistic, lest the show open itself up to the most ironic lawsuit ever. Overall, I think it was a fairly balanced episode, as Abbie Carmichael voiced a very strong defense of the 2nd Amendment. As for these pages, it's a great excuse to rewatch every episode of a great show, and capping all 456 episodes is a challenge I readily accept. Given NBC's struggles of late, I'm a bit shocked no one has at least floated the idea of bringing back Law & Order. --Funkychinaman (talk) 12:13, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- It isn't a Skorpion, note the ar-15 type safety in the first image. It is actually a Leinad Skorpion Pistol, and cheap POS in kind of the shape of a vz. 61. Can't find a good image of it right now, but it has the AR-15 safety and the wide bolt slots. --commando552 (talk) 15:52, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Thanks! I knew if there was something to be found, you'd find it. I looked on Google, and everything seems to match up except for the mounting for the shoulder stock. Since both the Leinad and the "Rolf 9" were sold as pistols, its existence is baffling. --Funkychinaman (talk) 15:59, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Got an image:--commando552 (talk) 16:01, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Thanks! --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:02, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- After a bit more searching I found that the original gun was manufactured by Armitage International as the "Scarab Skorpion" from 1989-1990, and at some point after this Leinad started producing them (possibly part of Cobray, I'm not sure). I think the gun may actually be an original Armitage, as there is one of them in The Specialists inventory. That stud at the back is not for a stock, but is a sling point. --commando552 (talk) 16:08, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- That would explain the brown grip. And it looks like the protruding piece in the fourth cap is a takedown pin. This makes sense, as Trope immediately starts disassembling it once McCoy hands it to him. If the barrel is threaded, then the barrel shroud might actually be a real accessory, and not just something the armorer threw on to disguise it. --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:22, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- I have seen these with the barrel shroud and it is longer. However, as it is just a simple tube you could cut it off shorter and end up with what you have here, which is essential a thread protector with the real muzzle stocking out the front. I just realise that the shape of the receiver is different at the front between the Armitage and the Leinad, and I think this is an Armitage. There were only 600 of these made so it is pretty rare, which strikes me as odd for this kind of weapon. --commando552 (talk) 16:35, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- It makes sense the me. The episode deals with a gun, the "Rolf 9," that has a design flaw that allows people to easily convert it to full auto. The company that manufactures it knows about the design flaw, but refuses to fix it because they know people are only buying that gun BECAUSE it's easily convertible, and that sales will plummet if they do, which McCoy argues is depraved indifference to human life, and thus Murder 2. Picking a gun that is rare and well out of production protects everyone. --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:54, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- I have seen these with the barrel shroud and it is longer. However, as it is just a simple tube you could cut it off shorter and end up with what you have here, which is essential a thread protector with the real muzzle stocking out the front. I just realise that the shape of the receiver is different at the front between the Armitage and the Leinad, and I think this is an Armitage. There were only 600 of these made so it is pretty rare, which strikes me as odd for this kind of weapon. --commando552 (talk) 16:35, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- That would explain the brown grip. And it looks like the protruding piece in the fourth cap is a takedown pin. This makes sense, as Trope immediately starts disassembling it once McCoy hands it to him. If the barrel is threaded, then the barrel shroud might actually be a real accessory, and not just something the armorer threw on to disguise it. --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:22, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- After a bit more searching I found that the original gun was manufactured by Armitage International as the "Scarab Skorpion" from 1989-1990, and at some point after this Leinad started producing them (possibly part of Cobray, I'm not sure). I think the gun may actually be an original Armitage, as there is one of them in The Specialists inventory. That stud at the back is not for a stock, but is a sling point. --commando552 (talk) 16:08, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Thanks! --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:02, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Got an image:--commando552 (talk) 16:01, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Thanks! I knew if there was something to be found, you'd find it. I looked on Google, and everything seems to match up except for the mounting for the shoulder stock. Since both the Leinad and the "Rolf 9" were sold as pistols, its existence is baffling. --Funkychinaman (talk) 15:59, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- It isn't a Skorpion, note the ar-15 type safety in the first image. It is actually a Leinad Skorpion Pistol, and cheap POS in kind of the shape of a vz. 61. Can't find a good image of it right now, but it has the AR-15 safety and the wide bolt slots. --commando552 (talk) 15:52, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- The shape and the pistol grip scream Skorpion, but everything else seems a bit off. McCoy does hand it to Trope (who had already plead guilty and was actually a witness for the prosecution) and Trope does disassemble it and show how he converted it to full auto. Apparently, it only involved filing down part of the bolt (which many characters commented on during the episode), swapping out one of the springs, and soldering (welding?) in a new guide plate. I highly doubt it is any way realistic, lest the show open itself up to the most ironic lawsuit ever. Overall, I think it was a fairly balanced episode, as Abbie Carmichael voiced a very strong defense of the 2nd Amendment. As for these pages, it's a great excuse to rewatch every episode of a great show, and capping all 456 episodes is a challenge I readily accept. Given NBC's struggles of late, I'm a bit shocked no one has at least floated the idea of bringing back Law & Order. --Funkychinaman (talk) 12:13, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Wow, a lot of interesting stuff. Good to know some of this. And yeah, it is a great show, this episode we're talking about is one of my favs. Anyway, good to know we got a man for the job of doing this show. StanTheMan (talk) 21:59, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Thanks. I still can't believe it's over. I'd like to think NBC's absolutely disastrous ratings of late are punishment for cancelling this show and bungling L&O:LA. --Funkychinaman (talk) 22:08, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
- Wow, a lot of interesting stuff. Good to know some of this. And yeah, it is a great show, this episode we're talking about is one of my favs. Anyway, good to know we got a man for the job of doing this show. StanTheMan (talk) 21:59, 18 April 2013 (EDT)
"Rolf 9" disassembly
In twenty seasons, this is probably the most we've seen of a gun on the show. --Funkychinaman (talk) 14:35, 20 April 2013 (EDT)
- You know, given that there is a 'trivia' section on the main page, maybe all this could be moved there? I think it would be a good addition to the main page. StanTheMan (talk) 15:33, 7 February 2014 (EST)